Q&A: Charting Fallujah's Course

The top Marine commander in Fallujah predicts Iraqi police will be ready to control the city in six months.

FALLUJAH,

On the status of reconstruction and development: 

KEVIN SITES: "We have experienced a full year since al Fazur, the battle for Fallujah. I think the Marines considered it a success. Where are we a year later after this battle? Where is Fallujah both in terms of security and reconstruction, and in terms of moving forward with the rest of Iraq?"

COL. DAVID BERGER: "The answer to that is probably not so simple. I think in a lot of ways, much further along than some would have anticipated. In some ways, understandably the folks in Fallujah are frustrated that things have not gone faster. The reconstruction part is going pretty well, I think, on personal and individual compensation for people with homes damaged and property damaged.

"What's frustrating the Iraqis is the other part, which is the commercial part. If we don't address that, unemployment is going to remain high, and that bleeds over into security and a lot of other issues. And rightfully so. They're fighting hard to open up the piggybank in Baghdad to get compensation for commercial businesses."

SITES: "There's supposed to be, I think, $30 million in reconstruction funds from the Iraqi government. Has that been coming through?"

BERGER: "Not a dime."

SITES: "Why not?"

BERGER: "Good question. It's the same question city leaders asked the ambassador when he was down here a couple weeks ago, just after the referendum. They say they're happy with the way the compensation is going individually, but economically it's flat and they need the central government to free up the money. They don't know, and neither do I, why it hasn't started to flow. It's been promised, but it's not here. Without it, businesses can't get off the ground. There are a lot of unemployed people. They need money; they have families to support."

On the potential for more violence, the drive to secure the city and the number of people who have returned in the past year: 

BERGER: "If you get paid a certain amount of money to lay an IED [improvised explosive device] or throw a grenade, that's quick money. I'm saying that because a lot of the friction we get is not from al Qaeda in Iraq ... there's a portion that are just doing it straight out of economics.

"This town was built on some big factories. The big factories haven't reopened, and it's been very frustrating. [Fallujah's residents] don't see any progress, they don't see any action. They hear a lot of words, a lot of promises, but not a lot of product."

SITES: "Frustrating from the point that if something doesn't get done soon there is the potential for more violence? Have you noticed anything that is manifesting that frustration?"

BERGER: "No, not at all. It isn't at that kind of tipping point where if things don't improve in another month it's going to go south, no not at all. The two biggest reasons are the [Iraqi] army and the Iraqi police. We've spent a long time working with them -- especially the army. They're firmly entrenched here, people know, and they have a good confidence level.

"And the police are also a big factor here. ... There are a thousand, maybe 1,100 police and they are on the streets every day, 24/7. The people very much trust them and look to them for security, and I think in another six months [the Iraqi police] will be in control of the whole city themselves. And the army and the rest of the military forces will continue to push out."

SITES: "You're saying in six months the police will be able to control the whole city?"

BERGER: "If they keep on going like they're going, yes."

SITES: "How is this police force different, which, along with the Iraqi national guard back in April 2004, turned the city over to insurgents?"

BERGER: "It's more confident, it's more highly trained, and that makes all the difference in the world. There's still a lot of perception that some of the police have too much loyalty to certain parts of the city, and won't be objective as law enforcement parties. But I think the police chief and the leadership he has selected is key to making sure that doesn't happen. He has even established an internal affairs-type section that roots out -- just like any police force does -- those people that are working both sides.

"The big difference is training, absolutely. And there are a lot of little things, like in any military law enforcement: uniforms, discipline, holding people accountable. Those things didn't exist eight or 10 months ago; now they do."

SITES: "In the year since the battle for Fallujah, have you been successful in keeping the insurgents from returning, and also keeping the weapons flow out?

BERGER: "Yes. I don't just think so. Statistically, when you look at it, there's no question."

SITES: "Is there an ambient level of violence that's always there?"

BERGER: "Yes, I'm sure there is. It's higher than I'd like. But because the control points in the city are manned so efficiently, there's always an influx that's going to get through, but the cordon and containment is good. There's going to be some that get through but it's absolutely manageable. And it's so small that there is not going to be a buildup in the city."

SITES: "Has there been an official estimate in the number of people that have returned since the battle for Fallujah last year?"

BERGER: "Official I don't know. Our best guess is about 150,000 people right now."

SITES: "Out of, what was it, 300,000 before?"

BERGER: "I think it was closer to 230,000 or 250,000."

On the strategy for training the Iraqi army and police: 

SITES: "If the United States wants to get out of Iraq militarily, it's going to have to accelerate the process of training the Iraqi army and Iraqi police. I've seen with the different units that I've been with, maybe one embedded adviser per company. Perhaps that's not enough?"

BERGER: "The counter to that is that too many advisers becomes a crutch to every operation and every planning effort. If it's done by U.S. guys that say, "We know how to do it," we sometimes think we're going to show you how to do it but then we just go ahead and do it. So we can get it right the first time. So there is a balance. Too many advisers make it too easy [for the Iraqis to lean on them]. I think the balance is right. With what they're working with right now -- at brigade, battalion, company staff -- it's about right. If you pile more on there it's going to take away some of the incentive for [the Iraqis] to do the work themselves, and muddle their way through it.

"You have to accept when you're in that training mode, you're going to have to accept some hiccups, you're going to have to accept some time to learn along the way. That's what's frustrating for some junior officers, who say, 'God, I told you how to do it.' But you have to allow them to branch out on their own. As long as you're there to back them up, and as long as security-wise you're not going to cause any sacrifices, you've got to push them out. You've got to let them learn."

Note: Because of recurrent issues with transmission gear, Kevin Sites has not yet been able to send the video for this interview. Instead, he played it over the phone to Hot Zone producer Robert Padavick, who transcribed and posted this text version. 

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